The Dark Knight Rises

[felipe-11]

QUOTE (JollyRoger @ Jul 31 2012, 08:02 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I have to say, I was furious with the ending, and almost left the cinema. I dunno why the only way to try and make interesting stories for DC includes killing off their main character. First Soops, and now Batman. There is only one Batman and that is Bruce Wayne.

Then wait, why are you p155ed? He didn't die...

QUOTE (JollyRoger @ Jul 31 2012, 08:02 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The Blake story is unnecessary, and even shows that Nolan didn't quite get all the aspects of the Batman universe. If you wanna include Robin do so, don't make him someone else.

QUOTE (Nightrider @ Jul 31 2012, 10:15 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't think the John Blake character was ever intended in this movie, or the future, to become Robin. The name Robin was thrown in as a tribute to Robin, the same as the football players name on his shirt is Ward, a nod to Burt Ward, at least that's what I think.

I agree with Nightrider on this one, after seeing how faithful Nolan has been to most aspects of the characters throughtout the trilogy, he wouldn't just "make up" a Robin. I just saw it as an indication of Batman's legacy continuing, but with a wink to Robin.

QUOTE (Nightrider @ Jul 31 2012, 10:15 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Created his own car, computer, tools of the trade etc, I do not recall a Lucias Fox from my readings, but am old and may have forgotten.

Lucius goes back as far as 1979. I think he was in Batman: Year One, but I can't remember and don't have the comic with me. But yeah, he's not made up or anything.



Also one thing I forgot to mention, I thought Nolan showing Bruce's/Selina's happy ending was a total overkill. If he had ended the film with Alfred looking up and smiling, it would've been perfect, we'd know he was alive without looking so out of place. Just like he ended Inception, we all know what happens but he's not all up in your face about it. It seems so unlike him, I suspect the studio might have forced him to include that shot because they figured that the little kids who are going to see this might not have gotten it so easily and it would've be kind of devastating for them to think Batman dies... even if he really didn't.

[JollyRoger]

QUOTE (felipe-11 @ Aug 1 2012, 01:28 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Then wait, why are you p155ed? He didn't die...

In the public's eye he did. His grave is at Wayne Manor from where he will never again be Batman.

[JollyRoger]

In the Hush Batman series, Wayne helps out a cripple who by chance is a master mechanic/IT guy, by giving him as home and granting him access to the cave where he works on the Bat-computer; Harold was his name. In my eyes, the Fox character is thrown in as a pendant of sorts.

[Irrob]

QUOTE (ShokXoneStudios @ Jul 30 2012, 06:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I had some minor issues with it, but it did exactly what it set out to do: ROCK. My full thoughts here.

Saw this twice in real IMAX last week. I favor your review over the others in this thread.

[Kernie]

QUOTE (felipe-11 @ Jul 31 2012, 01:16 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Also, I'd like to point out that while I absolutely LOVED The Avengers, I cannot for the life of me understand why people are comparing the two...
Other than the fact that they're both summer blockbusters based on comic-books they have almost nothing in common... Batman is arguably not even a superhero and the trilogy deals mostly with ideas about justice, crime and anarchy, while The Avengers is about aliens invading Earth...

Comparing things is what fanboys do best! :P

I never understand why people feel that apples and oranges can't be compared. A person can easily prefer the taste of apples over oranges, or vice versa, for a myriad of reasons... it just comes down to how they are being compared. If someone were to ask me which is the more skill-fully crafted piece of filmmaking, I would say Dark Knight Rises... if someone were to ask which one I thought was more fun to watch, I'd say Avengers. I like both films, both will be day-one Blu-ray purchases, and I'll continue to watch both for years to come.

QUOTE (Nightrider @ Jul 31 2012, 08:15 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Alfred leaving wasn't him deserting Bruce, it was him as he said, doing the only, in his mind that he could, to try and save Bruce. Alfred wanted Bruce to be safe and happy and enjoy his life.

How does his leaving "save" Bruce? I realize Alfred probably intended this to be a grand gesture to show his disapproval of Bruce's actions, but Alfred's been enabling Batman all this time, sowing his wounds and helping him create the costume. He's essentially Bruce's surrogate father. I don't have children, so I can't answer this, but could a father who loves his son really abandon him so completely as Alfred did, especially when he knows Bruce is going to put himself in danger again anyway? Why leave and risk not being there to help Bruce when he truly needs him? I'm sorry, but Alfred is loyal to the end... he wouldn't leave the last member of his beloved Wayne family to die.

QUOTE (Nightrider @ Jul 31 2012, 08:15 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't think the John Blake character was ever intended in this movie, or the future, to become Robin. The name Robin was thrown in as a tribute to Robin, the same as the football players name on his shirt is Ward, a nod to Burt Ward, at least that's what I think.

I agree, I don't know if Nolan intended Blake to become "Robin" or take over as "Batman," but it was a mean tease for the fans to throw the "Robin" name into the mix. I would have rather they never included the "Robin" scene at all... Nolan obviously knew the fan frenzy he would create by dropping the "Robin" name, and I think he did it just to drive us crazy with rampant speculation. Personally, I would have been much happier with the huge amount of screentime given to the Blake character had it turned out that Blake was a witness protection alias for "Dick Grayson" the whole time. The idea that a completely made-up character is now inheriting the Batman legacy just doesn't sit well with me for some reason.

Also, the "Ward" name could have been a nod to Burt Ward, but it's also the actual football player's last name, Hines Ward, who played American football for the Pittsburgh Steelers (where the film was shot). It's possible Nolan (or someone on the crew) recognized the significance of the "Ward" name and chose to have Hines Ward be the featured football player running from the explosion, but it could have been a coincidence as well.

QUOTE (Nightrider @ Jul 31 2012, 08:15 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well one real complaint, Maggie Gyllenhaal.

I didn't care much for Gyllenhaal either, but Katie Holmes didn't bother you too? I thought her casting stuck out like a sore thumb amongst all of the seasoned veteran actors.

QUOTE (felipe-11 @ Jul 31 2012, 07:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It seems so unlike him, I suspect the studio might have forced him to include that shot because they figured that the little kids who are going to see this might not have gotten it so easily and it would've be kind of devastating for them to think Batman dies... even if he really didn't.

I'm not disagreeing with you on this point, it would have been better had we not seen Bruce and Selina and just knew from Alfred's expression that he saw them. But how come when it comes to something you don't like, you're passing the blame onto the studio? It could have very easily been Nolan's decision, even if it doesn't fit his usual M.O. I have no idea whose idea it was, so I'm not saying you're wrong, but don't let Nolan off the hook so easily.

QUOTE (JollyRoger @ Jul 31 2012, 07:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

In the Hush Batman series, Wayne helps out a cripple who by chance is a master mechanic/IT guy, by giving him as home and granting him access to the cave where he works on the Bat-computer; Harold was his name. In my eyes, the Fox character is thrown in as a pendant of sorts.

I'm not sure what you mean, JR? Could you please explain the connection between Harold and Lucius Fox?

[Kernie]

QUOTE (Irrob @ Jul 31 2012, 07:54 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Saw this twice in real IMAX last week. I favor your review over the others in this thread.

To be fair, SXS took the time to write an eloquent review... I'm just a rambling fanboy on a tiny soapbox.

[felipe-11]

I thought Maggie Gyllenhaal was the strongest female character in the trilogy aside from Catwoman. She might not be the prettiest, but she pulls off the "strong district attorney" type effortlessly. Plus she has great chemistry with Bale. I think people's main problem with her is that she isn't necessarily "attractive" and she sends out a pretty slutty vibe bouncing back and forth in between Bruce and Harvey Dent.

Katie Holmes was absolutely the worst actor in the trilogy. I still wonder how she got that role...

Marion Cotillard was a bit weak in her role too, I think Nolan's desire to try work with the same people just blinded him on casting that character...

QUOTE (kernie82 @ Jul 31 2012, 10:22 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm not disagreeing with you on this point, it would have been better had we not seen Bruce and Selina and just knew from Alfred's expression that he saw them. But how come when it comes to something you don't like, you're passing the blame onto the studio? It could have very easily been Nolan's decision, even if it doesn't fit his usual M.O. I have no idea whose idea it was, so I'm not saying you're wrong, but don't let Nolan off the hook so easily.

Usually I wouldn't, but it just really sticks out this time... I mean we're talking about the guy who did Memento and Inception... he expects a lot out of his audience and it feels like that was dumbed down a bit, as if someone definitely thought that people might not get that. Yes, it could've been his own choice, but it seems very unlikely to me...

[JollyRoger]

QUOTE (kernie82 @ Aug 1 2012, 02:22 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm not sure what you mean, JR? Could you please explain the connection between Harold and Lucius Fox?

In the Hush series, Harold is the tech guy, helping Bruce to create the bat computer, and all the other gadgets; much like Fox is doing in the movies, only Harold is a cripple with no speech.

[Kernie]

QUOTE (JollyRoger @ Jul 31 2012, 09:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

In the Hush series, Harold is the tech guy, helping Bruce to create the bat computer, and all the other gadgets; much like Fox is doing in the movies, only Harold is a cripple with no speech.

Oh, okay... makes sense. Sorry I didn't see what you were getting at.

But just to clarify for Nightrider... both Harold and Lucius Fox are characters from the comic books. Although you're right, in the earlier Batman comics, I think Wayne built it all himself (or re-appropriated WayneTech equipment). In the more recent stories, Harold or Fox are usually helping Bruce out.

[Nightrider]

QUOTE (felipe-11 @ Aug 1 2012, 09:28 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Lucius goes back as far as 1979. I think he was in Batman: Year One, but I can't remember and don't have the comic with me. But yeah, he's not made up or anything.



Also one thing I forgot to mention, I thought Nolan showing Bruce's/Selina's happy ending was a total overkill. If he had ended the film with Alfred looking up and smiling, it would've been perfect, we'd know he was alive without looking so out of place. Just like he ended Inception, we all know what happens but he's not all up in your face about it. It seems so unlike him, I suspect the studio might have forced him to include that shot because they figured that the little kids who are going to see this might not have gotten it so easily and it would've be kind of devastating for them to think Batman dies... even if he really didn't.

Ah, thanks felipe, he came along after when I was reading, cheers.
I thought the end with Bruce and Selina was kind of finalising the relationship Batman and Catwoman had....Not everyone who sees these movies are long time Batman fans so a bit of licence was used here and there?