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Nightrider
post Aug 1 2012, 02:01 AM
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QUOTE (kernie82 @ Aug 1 2012, 11:42 AM) *
But just to clarify for Nightrider... both Harold and Lucius Fox are characters from the comic books. Although you're right, in the earlier Batman comics, I think Wayne built it all himself (or re-appropriated WayneTech equipment). In the more recent stories, Harold or Fox are usually helping Bruce out. 8824.gif 8824.gif 8824.gif

Thanks kernie, that does clarify it 8834.gif

Going to read the longer posts in this thread later today as the bat signal just went up from my dad, ie he has rung me a computer issue and I have to go help him, back later to read more
cheers guys 8834.gif


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Nightrider
post Aug 1 2012, 09:41 AM
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QUOTE (kernie82 @ Aug 1 2012, 10:22 AM) *
Comparing things is what fanboys do best! tongue2.gif

I never understand why people feel that apples and oranges can't be compared. A person can easily prefer the taste of apples over oranges, or vice versa, for a myriad of reasons... it just comes down to how they are being compared. If someone were to ask me which is the more skill-fully crafted piece of filmmaking, I would say Dark Knight Rises... if someone were to ask which one I thought was more fun to watch, I'd say Avengers. I like both films, both will be day-one Blu-ray purchases, and I'll continue to watch both for years to come.



How does his leaving "save" Bruce? I realize Alfred probably intended this to be a grand gesture to show his disapproval of Bruce's actions, but Alfred's been enabling Batman all this time, sowing his wounds and helping him create the costume. He's essentially Bruce's surrogate father. I don't have children, so I can't answer this, but could a father who loves his son really abandon him so completely as Alfred did, especially when he knows Bruce is going to put himself in danger again anyway? Why leave and risk not being there to help Bruce when he truly needs him? I'm sorry, but Alfred is loyal to the end... he wouldn't leave the last member of his beloved Wayne family to die.


I agree, I don't know if Nolan intended Blake to become "Robin" or take over as "Batman," but it was a mean tease for the fans to throw the "Robin" name into the mix. I would have rather they never included the "Robin" scene at all... Nolan obviously knew the fan frenzy he would create by dropping the "Robin" name, and I think he did it just to drive us crazy with rampant speculation. Personally, I would have been much happier with the huge amount of screentime given to the Blake character had it turned out that Blake was a witness protection alias for "Dick Grayson" the whole time. The idea that a completely made-up character is now inheriting the Batman legacy just doesn't sit well with me for some reason.

Also, the "Ward" name could have been a nod to Burt Ward, but it's also the actual football player's last name, Hines Ward, who played American football for the Pittsburgh Steelers (where the film was shot). It's possible Nolan (or someone on the crew) recognized the significance of the "Ward" name and chose to have Hines Ward be the featured football player running from the explosion, but it could have been a coincidence as well.


I didn't care much for Gyllenhaal either, but Katie Holmes didn't bother you too? I thought her casting stuck out like a sore thumb amongst all of the seasoned veteran actors.

Ok fair enough, no problem 8834.gif
On the apples and oranges, yes I do have to agree with how you have put it, you did that very well, you actually have extended what I was thinking by giving both films their credit for what each of them are and while people will be able to enjoy 2 very different hero movies, they are actually great examples of different ends of the spectrum.

I was thinking that Alfred leaving Bruce was Alfred's shock treatment play, right or wrong, he saw it as his only way to get his message across, a cruel to be kind kind of thing.
No, any parent who loves their child wouldn't abandon them, but maybe Alfred just couldn't do it anymore, he was afraid Bruce was going to get himself killed and simply couldn't stand to be there when it happened, it was just to much for him to watch??... He loved Bruce to much to, for as he saw it, contribute to his final moments...Maybe...I'm clutching at straws a bit because unless Nolan states the reason we'll never know, we can only guess. But I do agree that Alfred would never abandon Bruce/Batman, he would be there until the end. And even then he would stay and keep the Batcave, at least, almost in a shrine kind of state.

I understand what you're saying about the 'Robin' thing, maybe Nolan was just being a bit smart about it, maybe he felt it was simply a tribute, we might find out on the blu ray.
Another, however remote possibility, is he is thinking of doing another movie, but not Batman???

Good point on the Ward name, it sounds like it may have served 2 purposes, worked out pretty cool.

Katie Holmes did bother me, quite a bit to be honest, we were hoping she was gonna get blown up in Batman Begins, like no more than half way through! Her casting did stick out for sure, she was way to young, she was the same age as Bruce? Didn't look like it at all.
Don't ask me to choose between the 2, I simply can't do it.




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Nightrider
post Aug 1 2012, 09:45 AM
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QUOTE (JollyRoger @ Aug 1 2012, 09:38 AM) *
In the public's eye he did. His grave is at Wayne Manor from where he will never again be Batman.

That's true, both Bruce and Batman "died"
Batman has a statue in his honour and remembrance and Bruce has a grave and a head stone


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JollyRoger
post Aug 1 2012, 11:40 AM
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Can't recall Fox from 'Year: One', will have to read that one again 8834.gif - Oh, and didn't know he can be tracked back to '79.


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Kernie
post Aug 1 2012, 12:34 PM
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QUOTE (JollyRoger @ Aug 1 2012, 07:40 AM) *
Can't recall Fox from 'Year: One', will have to read that one again 8834.gif - Oh, and didn't know he can be tracked back to '79.

I first became aware of Lucius Fox from his appearances in the 90's Batman: The Animated Series. Don't recall him being in Year One, either... but I could be wrong.


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post Aug 2 2012, 01:11 AM
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QUOTE (JollyRoger @ Aug 1 2012, 09:40 AM) *
Can't recall Fox from 'Year: One', will have to read that one again 8834.gif - Oh, and didn't know he can be tracked back to '79.



QUOTE (kernie82 @ Aug 1 2012, 10:34 AM) *
I first became aware of Lucius Fox from his appearances in the 90's Batman: The Animated Series. Don't recall him being in Year One, either... but I could be wrong.

Then I'm probably the one who's wrong, maybe it wasn't Year One. But yeah, wiki says 1979 was the first appearance, and he's been on several animated series too (the 90's show, Batman Beyond...)


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